commune déléguée

English translation: delegated municipality

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:commune déléguée
English translation:delegated municipality
Entered by: joanna menda

19:26 Sep 14, 2020
French to English translations [PRO]
Certificates, Diplomas, Licenses, CVs / Birth certificate
French term or phrase: commune déléguée
Hi,

I am translating a French birth certificate for Australia and their is a stamp with the following

Copie délivrée conforme au registre
Saint-Germain-en-Laye, Commune déléguée de Saint-Germain-en-Laye

What exactly is a "commune déléguée" is there an English equivalent?

Thanks

Joanna
joanna menda
Canada
Local time: 04:56
delegated municipality
Explanation:
You will get a few hits if you search "commune déléguée"+ "delegated municipality".
Also, this site talks about the "delegated municipality" of Saint-Germain-en-Laye ://www.archyworldys.com/saint-germain-en-laye-fourqueux-will-h...
However, I suspect there might be a more precise term.

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Note added at 37 mins (2020-09-14 20:04:08 GMT)
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Wiki explains quite well what a "commune déléguée" is: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commune_nouvelle#Communes_délé...
Selected response from:

Marco Solinas
Local time: 01:56
Grading comment
Thanks
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
2 +3delegated municipality
Marco Solinas
4 +1subsidiary district
Gordon Matthews
3 -1sub-division of the larger/new municipality of ...
Thomas Miles
Summary of reference entries provided
Put together but still separate
Daryo

Discussion entries: 4





  

Answers


24 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): +3
delegated municipality


Explanation:
You will get a few hits if you search "commune déléguée"+ "delegated municipality".
Also, this site talks about the "delegated municipality" of Saint-Germain-en-Laye ://www.archyworldys.com/saint-germain-en-laye-fourqueux-will-h...
However, I suspect there might be a more precise term.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 37 mins (2020-09-14 20:04:08 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Wiki explains quite well what a "commune déléguée" is: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commune_nouvelle#Communes_délé...

Marco Solinas
Local time: 01:56
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in ItalianItalian
PRO pts in category: 20
Grading comment
Thanks

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  writeaway: both terms easily findable in Fr-En dicos
26 mins

disagree  Thomas Miles: You also get a few hits when you search ""the moon is made of cheese"
16 hrs

agree  liz askew: C_2020042EN.01000601.xml - EUR-Lexeur-lex.europa.eu › legal-content › TXT › HTML 7 Feb 2020 - two municipalities (La Boissière-du-Doré, La Remaudière) and part of one ... a minimum natural alcoholic strength by volume of 10 %, ... Department of Maine-et-
18 hrs

agree  Daryo: it seems to be specific to the French system, so obviously it won't ring any bell outside France.
22 hrs

agree  Georgia Psychrami
1 day 27 mins
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9 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
sub-division of the larger/new municipality of ...


Explanation:
From what I have read, this is the end result that, if anything, will be of interest for something like a birth certificate.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 hrs (2020-09-15 05:21:18 GMT)
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"À cet égard, l’on peut considérer que le modèle retenu par le législateur est proche de celui des arrondissements de Paris, Marseille et Lyon." (weka.fr)

Thomas Miles
France
Local time: 09:56
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Daryo: no - it would work ONLY if they keep the structure of each fusioned municipality unchanged. The point of "commune déléguée" is that nothing changed except losing the legal status of a distinct "personne morale".
13 hrs
  -> Fair enough. I still think 'delegated municipality' is lacking.
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1 day 13 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
subsidiary district


Explanation:
I'm persuaded that "metropolitan district" does not fit the bill, so here's a better suggestion.
I believe "subsidiary district" is both meaningful and accurate as a translation of "commune déléguée". An alternative might be "constituent local authority". In (21st century) British English I feel that "district" or "local authority" is preferable to "municipality". I don't know about Australian English.
I don't see the point in creating a term, "delegated municipality", which is meaningless to a native speaker of English (because only individual persons can be delegated or, as in this case, powers may be delegated to a sub-division of a municipality. It is the powers which are delegated, not the municipality.).
Rather than create a meaningless "English" term, it would be better to leave "commune déléguée" untranslated and include an explanation in brackets, if necessary.

Gordon Matthews
Germany
Local time: 09:56
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Thomas Miles: Your reasoning deserves an agree. However, I think it is best to reserve 'district' for 'arrondissement'.
11 hrs
  -> Thanks for agreement!

neutral  Daryo: "commune déléguée" untranslated and include an explanation in brackets, if necessary - that would make sense
2 days 1 hr
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Reference comments


22 hrs
Reference: Put together but still separate

Reference information:
Statut
La commune nouvelle est une commune dotée des mêmes compétences que les autres communes françaises. Il s'agit d'une collectivité territoriale qui se substitue aux communes fusionnées.

Les communes fusionnées subsistent sous forme de communes déléguées, reprenant le nom et les limites territoriales des anciennes communes mais ne disposant pas de la personnalité morale, selon un fonctionnement inspiré de celui instauré par la Loi PLM, les communes déléguées ayant des compétences proches de celles des arrondissements municipaux. Toutefois, le conseil municipal de la commune nouvelle peut décider par une délibération de ne pas maintenir les diverses communes déléguées.

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commune_nouvelle#Communes_délé...

If you want anything vaguely comparable in UK, it would be how on 1 April 1965 the whole of Greater London was subdivided in a reduced number of territorial units.

before
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/ce/Greater_...

and after
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/29/Lo...

here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_boroughs

you can find the list showing how previous territorial units were regrouped.

The BIG difference is that when new boroughs were created all traces of the previous structures were erased - all over London there are many ex "town halls" of defunct districts that are just building with names on them than mean nothing today.

For example "Kensington and Chelsea" was created by from "Kensington" and "Chelsea" - but these "components" lost all individuality in the new "Kensington and Chelsea".

Had the part that was previously "Chelsea" maintained its own structure unchanged, it would have been "une commune déléguée" of the fusioned "Kensington and Chelsea".

Daryo
United Kingdom
Native speaker of: Native in SerbianSerbian, Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 3
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