Jul 27, 2006 09:02
17 yrs ago
4 viewers *
German term
United Kingdom
For the Love of Language
Native in: English
Works in: German to English, French to English
wissenschaftshistorisch
German to English
Science
Science (general)
history of science
Is there an adjective like this in English? I can't find one, or an elegant way of wording this sentence:
"Es ist höchst begrüßenswert, daß es in der vergangenen Dekade mehrere verdienstvolle Versuche gegeben hat, in speziellen Veranstaltungen dem **wissenschaftshistorischen** Aspekt der Präsenz der "Orientlateiner" in Palästina nachzugehen."
"Es ist höchst begrüßenswert, daß es in der vergangenen Dekade mehrere verdienstvolle Versuche gegeben hat, in speziellen Veranstaltungen dem **wissenschaftshistorischen** Aspekt der Präsenz der "Orientlateiner" in Palästina nachzugehen."
Proposed translations
(English)
| 3 +1 | in the context of the history of science |
Nick Somers (X)
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| 4 | from the perspective/ point of view of historical science/historiography |
nic456
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| 3 | scientific historical |
Harry Borsje
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| 3 | (needs to be paraphrased) |
Gert Sass (M.A.)
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| 4 -2 | historical science |
natalia m (X)
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Proposed translations
+1
1 hr
Selected
in the context of the history of science
something like that
I think "history of science" is clearer than "scientific history"
I think "history of science" is clearer than "scientific history"
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
TonyTK
: Quite a mouthful (as the actress ...) but surely the best solution
10 mins
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| neutral |
Harry Borsje
: I don't know whether 'Orientlatainer' have been relevant for the history of science in Palestine, although they may have been relevant from an historical point of view, based on scientifically proven facts
40 mins
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| neutral |
nic456
: It cannot be history of science if the context is not science. It is far from obvious.
2 hrs
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I don't know whether the context is science, but that's what wissenschaftshistorisch normally means, imo. If the writer wants it to mean something else, he/she is being very misleading.
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "That's pretty much what I had anyway, but I hoped there would be an adjective. Schade! It's definitely "history of science" in this context - it's about the influence of Arab science on Europe via the crusaders and others."
15 mins
Harry Borsje
Netherlands
Netherlands
Specializes in field
Netherlands
Communicate technology with passion
Native in: Dutch 
Works in: German to Dutch, English to Dutch
Related KudoZ points
:
8
scientific historical
;-)
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
rainerc (X)
11 mins
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| disagree |
natalia m (X)
: yes, but you can't cut it off the sentence. wouldn't you rather say "aspect of historical science" than "scientic historical aspect"?
15 mins
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No... although I'd use scienti*fi*c historical aspect - just kidding ;-)
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| neutral |
Gert Sass (M.A.)
: Google hits for this wording stem from 2 domains all in all. Although it could be derived from "scientific history", the formation just does not sound standard English, which is a good reason why it has not become generally established as an adjective.
43 mins
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43 mins
Gert Sass (M.A.)
Germany
Germany
Native in German
Germany
Precision for those who appreciate it.
Native in: German
Works in: English to German, German to English, French to German, and 5 more.
(needs to be paraphrased)
e.g. "… the aspect of … which is so significant for the history of science"
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Note added at 5 hrs (2006-07-27 15:01:51 GMT)
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For all those who still confuse the history of science with historical science (ie, the science of history), historiography (ie, the science of history writing, which poses such problems as the necessary subjective boundaries of any historiograph´s personal involvement with his/her historical conditions, limiting his point of view, the inevitable shaping of historiographic "reports" according to narrative and mythical patterns validated through nothing more than tradition and so called "common sense", distinguishing historical science essentially from any "exact" science; for more info, refer to the discussion of Hayden White´s arguments and others), and anything that may pop up next, here is some input from a reliable source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_science):
"The history of science investigates the historical record of human events that are pertinent to the cultural context and the secular development of what is currently called science, namely, a body of empirical and theoretical knowledge, produced by a global community of researchers, making use of specific techniques for the observation and explanation of real phenomena, this techne as a whole being summed up under the heading of scientific method. As such, the history of science draws on the historical methods of both intellectual history and social history."
HTH
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Note added at 6 hrs (2006-07-27 15:08:08 GMT)
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Error (just besides): please read "any historiograph´s *work due to his/her* personal involvement" instead
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Note added at 5 hrs (2006-07-27 15:01:51 GMT)
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For all those who still confuse the history of science with historical science (ie, the science of history), historiography (ie, the science of history writing, which poses such problems as the necessary subjective boundaries of any historiograph´s personal involvement with his/her historical conditions, limiting his point of view, the inevitable shaping of historiographic "reports" according to narrative and mythical patterns validated through nothing more than tradition and so called "common sense", distinguishing historical science essentially from any "exact" science; for more info, refer to the discussion of Hayden White´s arguments and others), and anything that may pop up next, here is some input from a reliable source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_science):
"The history of science investigates the historical record of human events that are pertinent to the cultural context and the secular development of what is currently called science, namely, a body of empirical and theoretical knowledge, produced by a global community of researchers, making use of specific techniques for the observation and explanation of real phenomena, this techne as a whole being summed up under the heading of scientific method. As such, the history of science draws on the historical methods of both intellectual history and social history."
HTH
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Note added at 6 hrs (2006-07-27 15:08:08 GMT)
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Error (just besides): please read "any historiograph´s *work due to his/her* personal involvement" instead
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
rainerc (X)
: there is no need; 'scientific historical aspects' can be used perfectly well in the sentence.
2 mins
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-2
4 mins
historical science
aspect of historical science
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Note added at 10 hrs (2006-07-27 19:55:30 GMT)
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Well, it has nothing to do with Greek grammar rules. It is a so-called compound adjective. And if you don't believe me, you can check out the BBC website: "Other common patterns for compound adjectives include: .... adj + noun: deep-sea, full-length, last-minute ... " (http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/learningenglish/grammar/le...
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Note added at 10 hrs (2006-07-27 19:55:30 GMT)
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Well, it has nothing to do with Greek grammar rules. It is a so-called compound adjective. And if you don't believe me, you can check out the BBC website: "Other common patterns for compound adjectives include: .... adj + noun: deep-sea, full-length, last-minute ... " (http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/learningenglish/grammar/le...
Peer comment(s):
| disagree |
HarryHedgehog
: this is not an adjective, and therefore does not answer the question//Perhaps Greek has different grammar rules, but a multiword noun does not make an adjective in English. Sorry.
11 mins
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of course it is an adjective, when used before a noun. Examples: historical science collection, Historical Science Society!!!
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| disagree |
Gert Sass (M.A.)
: "Historical science" is the science of history rather than the history of science
45 mins
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1 hr
from the perspective/ point of view of historical science/historiography
I hope this clarifies matters a bit and elaborates on Gert Sass' hint.
Wissenschaftshistorisch = wissenschaftsgeschichtlich
Judging from the context and the key word Orientlateiner, it refers to history as science, i.e. historical science.
Trace with special events the presence of x from the perspective/ point of view of historiography [historical science]
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/historiography
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Note added at 22 hrs (2006-07-28 07:16:00 GMT)
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Clarification
Wissenschaftsgeschichtlich = adj referring to Wissenschaftsgeschichte
Geschichtswissenschaftlich = adj referring to Geschichtswissenschaft
Why did I suggest historiographical then?
History comprises many specialisms (social, political, of a country, of any science and science itself) and any historical research is historiographical.
Orientlateiner refers to two archbishops (Rodrigo Ximénez de Rada von Toledo and Wilhelm von Tyrus) whose major works are Geschichte der Araber and Geschichte der orientalischen Fürsten respectively. These are remarkable for covering the Muslim world from a Christian perspective, the perception of the other.
In my opinion, the only context the use of wissenschaftsgeschichtlich is appropriate would be for research on medieval scholasticism as a precursor of modern science.
Rachel, you will know best.
Wissenschaftshistorisch = wissenschaftsgeschichtlich
Judging from the context and the key word Orientlateiner, it refers to history as science, i.e. historical science.
Trace with special events the presence of x from the perspective/ point of view of historiography [historical science]
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/historiography
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 22 hrs (2006-07-28 07:16:00 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Clarification
Wissenschaftsgeschichtlich = adj referring to Wissenschaftsgeschichte
Geschichtswissenschaftlich = adj referring to Geschichtswissenschaft
Why did I suggest historiographical then?
History comprises many specialisms (social, political, of a country, of any science and science itself) and any historical research is historiographical.
Orientlateiner refers to two archbishops (Rodrigo Ximénez de Rada von Toledo and Wilhelm von Tyrus) whose major works are Geschichte der Araber and Geschichte der orientalischen Fürsten respectively. These are remarkable for covering the Muslim world from a Christian perspective, the perception of the other.
In my opinion, the only context the use of wissenschaftsgeschichtlich is appropriate would be for research on medieval scholasticism as a precursor of modern science.
Rachel, you will know best.
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Nick Somers (X)
: Wouldn't historiographical be "geschichtstechnisch"?
34 mins
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Please see explanatory note. I think geschichtswissenschaftlich would be preferable, otherwise it is simply methodologisch.
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Discussion