Glossary entry (derived from question below)
German term or phrase:
Kafernkiale
English translation:
Kaffer kraal/Kaffir hut
Added to glossary by
JLD_DE-EN
- The asker opted for community grading. The question was closed on 2018-09-29 16:54:08 based on peer agreement (or, if there were too few peer comments, asker preference.)
Sep 26, 2018 13:27
5 yrs ago
German term
Kafernkiale
May offend
German to English
Art/Literary
Architecture
Art History, architecture, travel, buildings, description, literary
Seeking help for the following sentence: 'Die Garagen, Benzinstationen und Lunchbuden, die überall am Wege stehen, sehen wie Eisgrotten aus, oder wie Kafernkiale, oder wie indianische Wigwams.'
It is a 1920s travelogue, describing American buildings: I cannot find a solution for 'Kafernkiale' - or indeed 'Eisgrotten' in this context.
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Thank you!
It is a 1920s travelogue, describing American buildings: I cannot find a solution for 'Kafernkiale' - or indeed 'Eisgrotten' in this context.
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Thank you!
Proposed translations
(English)
| 4 +5 | Kaffern-Kraal |
Yorkshireman
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| 5 | Kaffir's kraal |
Johannes Gleim
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Change log
Sep 30, 2018 10:06: JLD_DE-EN Created KOG entry
Oct 1, 2018 14:23: Yana Dovgopol changed "Term Context" from "Seeking help for the following sentence: \'Die Garagen, Benzinstationen und Lunchbuden, die überall am Wege stehen, sehen wie Eisgrotten aus, oder wie Kafernkiale, oder wie indianische Wigwams.\' It is a 1920s travelogue, describing American buildings: I cannot find a solution for \'Kafernkiale\' - or indeed \'Eisgrotten\' in this context. Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thank you!" to "Seeking help for the following sentence: \\\'Die Garagen, Benzinstationen und Lunchbuden, die überall am Wege stehen, sehen wie Eisgrotten aus, oder wie Kafernkiale, oder wie indianische Wigwams.\\\' It is a 1920s travelogue, describing American buildings: I cannot find a solution for \\\'Kafernkiale\\\' - or indeed \\\'Eisgrotten\\\' in this context. Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thank you!" , "May Offend" from "Not Checked" to "Checked"
Proposed translations
+5
1 hr
Selected
Kaffern-Kraal
Seems to be the only logical permutation. Tribal huts (Afrikans: Kraals) in Africa.
Kaffer = Kaffir
"Kaffir is an ethnic slur used to refer to a black person. In the form of cafri, it evolved during the pre-colonial period as an equivalent of "negro". In Southern Africa, the term was later used as an exonym for Bantu peoples."
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Note added at 17 hrs (2018-09-27 06:51:31 GMT)
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I wouldn't be at all surprised if the author thought that some of the buildings looked like igloos - and called them Eisgrotten (silly word!)
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Note added at 18 hrs (2018-09-27 07:37:24 GMT)
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Suggested translation: The service stations, gas stations and diners along the highways look like igloos, African grass huts or Red Indian teepees
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Note added at 18 hrs (2018-09-27 08:21:31 GMT)
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Mud huts would also be an option
Kaffer = Kaffir
"Kaffir is an ethnic slur used to refer to a black person. In the form of cafri, it evolved during the pre-colonial period as an equivalent of "negro". In Southern Africa, the term was later used as an exonym for Bantu peoples."
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 17 hrs (2018-09-27 06:51:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
I wouldn't be at all surprised if the author thought that some of the buildings looked like igloos - and called them Eisgrotten (silly word!)
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 18 hrs (2018-09-27 07:37:24 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Suggested translation: The service stations, gas stations and diners along the highways look like igloos, African grass huts or Red Indian teepees
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 18 hrs (2018-09-27 08:21:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Mud huts would also be an option
Reference:
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Thomas Pfann
: Guter Gedanke - die „Kaffern“ kamen mir auch kurz in den Sinn, oder etwas mit „Kasernen...“. Aber „Kaffernkraale“ ist logisch. Vermutlich liegt das Original in handschriftlicher Form (oder als Abschrift davon) vor.
44 mins
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Thanks Thomas - handwritten was my first thought, too
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| agree |
philgoddard
: Good thinking, and there's actually a picture of one in your reference. A kraal is a village rather than a hut.
2 hrs
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Thanks Phil, that's why I wrote huts, rather than hut
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| neutral |
Johannes Gleim
: wrong language direction, unfortunately.
5 hrs
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OK, Johannes - read through my post: Kaffer = Kaffir, and Kraal doesn't need to be translated. Thanks for your discussion entry and the elaboration on my answer.
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| agree |
Kim Metzger
: Kaffir kraal http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/cdm/ref/collection/p15799coll1...
6 hrs
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Thanks for the link, Kim
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| agree |
Lancashireman
: ice cream parlo(u)rs, straw huts and wigwams
9 hrs
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I like the ice cream parlo(u)rs - and I think you're right about huts rather than villages
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| agree |
Herbmione Granger
: Tough one. But this fits right in with igloos and wigwams.
21 hrs
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-hanks. I've just been looking at "highway architecture", there’s some really weird stuff!!
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
7 hrs
Johannes Gleim
Native in German
Works in field
40 years Engineer, 20 years translations
Native in: German
Works in: English to German, German to English, French to German, and 6 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
51
Kaffir's kraal
The source is „..sehen wie Eisgrotten aus, oder wie Kafernkiale … aus"
The target language is English
Yorkshireman has already found the German root for " Kafernkiale", but unfortunately missed to look for English.
Kaffir (alternatively kaffer; originally cafri) is an ethnic slur used to refer to a black person. In the form of cafri, it evolved during the pre-colonial period as an equivalent of "negro". In Southern Africa, the term was later used as an exonym for Bantu peoples. The designation came to be considered a pejorative by the 20th century.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaffir_(racial_term)
Kraal (also spelled craal or kraul) is an Afrikaans and Dutch word (also used in South African English) for an enclosure for cattle or other livestock, located within an African settlement or village surrounded by a fence of thorn-bush branches, a palisade, mud wall, or other fencing, roughly circular in form. It is similar to a boma in eastern or central Africa.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kraal
The English term should be like "kaffir’s kraal"
; of a kopje with its Boer farmer and his vrouw of a spruit, or a Kaffir's kraal; of oxen leaning against the disselboom of a cape-wagon; of a herd of steinboks, or a little colony of meerkats in the karoo.
https://books.google.de/books?id=j3IqBFtVsTUC&pg=PA84&lpg=PA...
is confirming the South-African source.
Following Berkeley-Hill's complaint and subsequent newspaper reports in the Statesman that the European Mental Hospital was 'worse than a kaffir's kraal', the provincial authorities demanded from central government his immediate removal.
https://books.google.de/books?id=En-WBQAAQBAJ&pg=PA10&lpg=PA...
At dawn we cut ourselves some stout sticks and pushed on. Soon we came to a broad, flat valley, open with the exception of a few clumps of trees, and dotted all over with farms and Kaffir huts.
:
We lay up until dark, and then went towards the huts; but to our inexpressible disgust there were no fires burning, no barking of dogs or chatter such as greets you from the children round a Kaffir kraal at night.
:
Our hope had been to find a Kaffir's kraal on and after squaring the Kaffirs, to lie up for a few days, replenish our stores and get some more boots or veldtschosen; but we did not find a kraal.
https://www.bwm.org.au/warcourse/Escape_from_Waterval.php
The target language is English
Yorkshireman has already found the German root for " Kafernkiale", but unfortunately missed to look for English.
Kaffir (alternatively kaffer; originally cafri) is an ethnic slur used to refer to a black person. In the form of cafri, it evolved during the pre-colonial period as an equivalent of "negro". In Southern Africa, the term was later used as an exonym for Bantu peoples. The designation came to be considered a pejorative by the 20th century.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaffir_(racial_term)
Kraal (also spelled craal or kraul) is an Afrikaans and Dutch word (also used in South African English) for an enclosure for cattle or other livestock, located within an African settlement or village surrounded by a fence of thorn-bush branches, a palisade, mud wall, or other fencing, roughly circular in form. It is similar to a boma in eastern or central Africa.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kraal
The English term should be like "kaffir’s kraal"
; of a kopje with its Boer farmer and his vrouw of a spruit, or a Kaffir's kraal; of oxen leaning against the disselboom of a cape-wagon; of a herd of steinboks, or a little colony of meerkats in the karoo.
https://books.google.de/books?id=j3IqBFtVsTUC&pg=PA84&lpg=PA...
is confirming the South-African source.
Following Berkeley-Hill's complaint and subsequent newspaper reports in the Statesman that the European Mental Hospital was 'worse than a kaffir's kraal', the provincial authorities demanded from central government his immediate removal.
https://books.google.de/books?id=En-WBQAAQBAJ&pg=PA10&lpg=PA...
At dawn we cut ourselves some stout sticks and pushed on. Soon we came to a broad, flat valley, open with the exception of a few clumps of trees, and dotted all over with farms and Kaffir huts.
:
We lay up until dark, and then went towards the huts; but to our inexpressible disgust there were no fires burning, no barking of dogs or chatter such as greets you from the children round a Kaffir kraal at night.
:
Our hope had been to find a Kaffir's kraal on and after squaring the Kaffirs, to lie up for a few days, replenish our stores and get some more boots or veldtschosen; but we did not find a kraal.
https://www.bwm.org.au/warcourse/Escape_from_Waterval.php
Discussion
So please refrain from insulting me and alleging (wrong) interest motives!
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Note added at 18 hrs (2018-09-27 08:21:31 GMT)
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Mud huts would also be an option"
On the other hand ... You will certainly confirm that "Kaffern-Kraal" isn't English, but German. And the asker asked for "German to English translations [PRO]". That's why I researched, too. At the end, the asker did not accept any answer, but mixed both proposals up to "Kaffer kraal/Kaffir hut".
At least one igloo, plenty of mud huts - round and adobe-style - boots and boats, aircraft, shells (obviously a gas station), hamburgers and hotdogs and many other weird and wonderful things that make the mind boggle.
Problem solved at one hour. Same solution parroted at seven hours. An open-and-shut case, I would say.
I personally find posting an answer raised to a rating of "absolute certainty" based on the imagination, research and explanations of other posters - particularly after posting a discussion entry that was far from helpful - to be rather unfair.
https://www.google.de/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd...
in the journal La Patria (Buenos Aire) from 1882 in Portuguese.
did not found the corrresponding phrase in the journal. Can the client help you?