Mar 23, 2020 16:53
4 yrs ago
28 viewers *
French term

un avantage acquis et un usage.

French to English Law/Patents Finance (general)
Can anyone confirm whether my translation of the following is correct, in particular "un avantage acquis et un usage"? A colleague thinks it is but I just wanted to be absolutely certain:

En conséquence, les parties signataires ne considèrent pas l'Intéressement versé comme un avantage acquis et un usage.

Consequently, the signatory parties do not consider the profit-share sum paid as a customary earned benefit.

Discussion

Germaine Mar 24, 2020:
Ici, "un avantage acquis et un usage" est utilisé dans le sens de "droit acquis" = un avantage qui ne peut être remis en cause par de nouvelles règles ou pratiques (an acquired benefit) et qui fait partie des pratiques usuelles. Dans ce sens, je dirais "...do not considerer the profit-sharing amount [bonus?] paid as an acquired and customary benefit [right?] - as Timothy puts it - or may be, "as an accrued and customary right" (a right that has become so fixed that it is not subject to being divested without consent of the owner).

D'ailleurs, à ma connaissance, ces régimes d'intéressement ne sont pas légion et ils comprennent tous des clauses qui garantissent à l'employeur qu'il peut mettre fin au régime à son entière discrétion.

Je n'utiliserais pas "vested benefit" - ni "vested interest" - qui pourrait porter à confusion dans ce régime, puisque les droits à l'intéressement font certainement l'objet de vesting conditions.
Daryo Mar 24, 2020:
A "standard practice" - the way I ever heard it used - is some industry-wide usual / default way of doing things - a kind of "standard", often a very formal standard. A "standard" would apply over a long period of time to a whole sector of activity, not just to two parties for maybe a limited period of time (as "l'usage" would imply).

Just realised what I said is a variation on "L'usage is normally "local" and not across the industry" ...

Timothy Rake Mar 24, 2020:
@Daryo I respect your remarks and your right to disagree. However, if you want to make a comment in the discussion section, that's the appropriate way to do so as a responder to the question. What I view as a little less than appropriate is to post a "disagree" on another answerer's response when you yourself have contributed as an answerer. I suppose I could do likewise with your response, in order to "ding" the "vote tally" for another answer. I don't believe that's how Kudoz should function. I haven't in the past, nor would I ever do so. In deciding KUDOZ, I believe that what IS appropriate is that third-parties decide who has posted the most viable option.
SafeTex Mar 23, 2020:
@ Tim I think you may be right and I got a case of second language interference. Customary could be the answer as you say.
Timothy Rake Mar 23, 2020:
@SafeTex semantics? in no way a "standard practice"? I would advocate that a custom is standard practice and in this case is more appropriate in a business setting than "custom." Although, I would also argue that perhaps "CUSTOMARY" could be appropriate in this case: "an acquired and customary benefit."
SafeTex Mar 23, 2020:
standard pratice v custom Hello

On this, I've loads of experience as I was a staff and Trade Union representative in France for 8 years.

L'usage is normally "local" and not across the industry, can be very specific to one particular job or person, often arises without a formal addendum to the contract, and can sometimes be withdrawn.

For me, it's a "custom" and in no way a "standard practice"

Regards

Proposed translations

+4
2 hrs
Selected

an acquired benefit and standard practice

or in plain speak, "it's not a "given or standard practice"
Peer comment(s):

agree philgoddard
1 hr
Merci Phil
agree AllegroTrans
2 hrs
merci!
disagree Daryo : s.t. would be seen as "standard practice" if its the presumed/established way to do thing for a whole industry and could be easily be formally codified, while s.t. can be "customary" just between two parties, as it is the case in this ST
6 hrs
agree Yvonne Gallagher
18 hrs
merci Yvonne!
agree Germaine : mais je préfère votre "customary benefit"
1 day 3 hrs
“Yes, Germaine “customary benefits”
agree erwan-l
1 day 11 hrs
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
1 hr

a right to use or an acquired advantage

Consequently, the signatory parties do not consider the profit-share sum paid as a right to use or an acquired advantage

suggestion
Peer comment(s):

neutral AllegroTrans : asker hasn't told us it's a profit-share scheme
21 hrs
Something went wrong...
-1
1 hr

an acquired right (to this benefit) and a custom

En conséquence, les parties signataires ne considèrent pas l'Intéressement versé comme un avantage acquis et un usage.
=>
Signatories agree that this payment of " l'Intéressement" is not to be considered as some newly acquired right nor as some newly established custom.



strictly speaking you have there two terms

un avantage acquis = it will become an acquired right

un usage = it will be customary from now one

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Note added at 1 hr (2020-03-23 18:35:34 GMT)
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or in plain speak - "it's just a one-off, don't get your hopes too high ..."

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2020-03-23 18:50:25 GMT)
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... from now on
Peer comment(s):

agree SafeTex : Yep, there seems to be two types of acquired rights (the other one for aliens or nationals) but I still like this despite that
20 mins
Thanks!
disagree AllegroTrans : "custom" is much too loose a word here
3 hrs
"this will not become customary" I can't see where is the big difference between "un usage" and s.t. being "customary/a custom" between two parties?? surely no one will confuse it with "customs = la douane"??? Too blindingly obvious from the context!
disagree Yvonne Gallagher : custom is too loose. Thanks, but don't need a response
19 hrs
Something went wrong...
-2
5 hrs

a vested interest and a custom

What Is a Vested Interest?
A vested interest generally refers to a personal stake or involvement in a project, investment, or outcome. In finance, a vested interest is the lawful right of an individual or entity to gain access to tangible or intangible property such as money, stocks, bonds, mutual funds, and other securities at some point in the future. There is usually a vesting period or time span before the claimant may gain access to the asset or property.

Source: Investopedia
Peer comment(s):

disagree AllegroTrans : "custom" is much too loose in context
17 hrs
how loose is loose?
disagree Germaine : Il y a sûrement des vesting conditions et probablement des vested profit shares dans ce régime, alors "vested" risque de porter à interprétation/confusion. Par ailleurs, on parle d'un avantage, pas d'un intérêt.
23 hrs
vested interest = avantage acquis in the anglo-saxon world.
Something went wrong...
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