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synchronisées sur la fréquence cardiaque
distal/proximal
May 22, 2021 13:04
2 yrs ago
37 viewers *
French term

A déduire à votre provision

French to English Law/Patents Law (general)
This is at the end of invoice details for a "état des lieux effectué par huissier", it is just after the VAT line and before the total amount.
I can translate all the inventory terminology but I am having trouble with the legal terms.
Any ideas?
Proposed translations (English)
4 Your provision to be deducted
3 +1 Minus your (sum of money)
3 Payment to be taken from ... [sum of money]
3 -1 To be deducted from your security deposit
4 -4 To be deducted from your provision

Discussion

Daryo Jun 7, 2021:
@jessjess as only you have the whole of this invoice, you can check/confirm that the amount under "A déduire votre provision" is in fact deducted from the running total of this invoice.
That would be the final cross-check.
Francois Boye Jun 5, 2021:
@ Allegro

Sorry! You didn't explain any expression in French.
AllegroTrans Jun 4, 2021:
Yes it does Your (provision or whatever) to be deducted. See my suggested answer svp
Francois Boye Jun 4, 2021:
@ Allegro

The correction doesn't make sense in French. What makes sense in French is 'à déduire DE votre provision'
AllegroTrans Jun 4, 2021:
Lisa Jessjess has corrected the term (it's actuallly à déduire votre provision")
Lisa Rosengard May 23, 2021:
leasing invoice "à déduire à votre provision"
"to be deducted from your provision, assuming that the provision is the money deposited at the beginning of the lease.
"état des lieux effectués par huissier" is
"an inventory of fixtures carried out by a bailiff."
Dominique Stiver May 23, 2021:
ce que j'indiquais car je voyais plus que cela si on parlait bien de provisions : il faut savoir si ce n'est n'est pas la provision qui est à déduire du compte de charges dues par le locataire à sa sortie des lieux.
jessjess (asker) May 23, 2021:
I am sorry I couldn't get this answer earlier, and since I am unfamiliar with legal terms, I thought it was a very specific structure.
jessjess (asker) May 23, 2021:
Hello again, I finally got the answer, it was a wrong transcription of the pdf document (i only got the word document). The phrase is "A déduire votre provision", in the line just before the total, I have been told it means in this line you can deduct any advance payment. Thank you very much for your help
Daryo May 23, 2021:
@ Francois Boye The real bad news is that in fact we don't have any really usable context.

Who is getting invoiced by whom?
There are plenty of parties potentially involved around a property lease, not only the tenant and the property owner.

What is exactly this invoice about?
If there is VAT to pay it must be about some kind of services or goods that ARE subject to VAT.

Knowing a bit more about these "secondary details" could throw some light on the exact nature of this "provision", for example ...

BTW there are some cases where "... à déduire à ...." is perfectly correct.
Francois Boye May 22, 2021:
I have a bad news for those who are talking about real estate.

the deduction from provisions in case of property or co-property in France is the land tax.See the attachment below:

https://www.immobilierloyer.com/location/revenus-fonciers/20...
Francois Boye May 22, 2021:
Does the tenant pay any VAT? The response is a resounding NO!
Dominique Stiver May 22, 2021:
c'est bien là le point à connaître afin de pouvoir donner une réponse ou un accord.
mchd May 22, 2021:
@ Jessjess
c'est possible également, à voir avec votre contexte. Généralement un état des lieux par huissier est établi lorsqu'un locataire indélicat a quitté les lieux après avoir commis des dégradations.
jessjess (asker) May 22, 2021:
Il se peut que ce soit la caution et qu'on demande au locataire entrant de payer la somme dûe pour l'état des lieux entrant?
jessjess (asker) May 22, 2021:
Bonjour, et merci de vos propositions! En fait je n'ai pas mis en doute la préposition "à" car en fait mon domaine de spécialisation se limite aux termes en lien avec l'habitation, je ne suis pas très forte en terminologie juridique. Tout le reste était traduit sauf ce terme.
Dominique Stiver May 22, 2021:
avec une erreur a priori de préposition, il faut savoir si ce n'est n'est pas la provision qui est à déduire du compte de charges dues par le locataire à sa sortie des lieux. Le contexte devrait permettre de déduire le sens réel. Et pourquoi ne pas demander tout simplement au client/à l'agence puisque le texte présente un problème...
mchd May 22, 2021:
@ Adrien Merci de votre compliment !
Cette préposition avait son importance au cas où JessJess aurait aimé faire des recherches personnelles sur ce mécanisme.
Effectivement, on boit à la bouteille, mais on déduit DE quelque chose !
Francois Boye May 22, 2021:
@ D. STiver,

Go to the attachment in my translation and you will find the contents
Dominique Stiver May 22, 2021:
bizarre :
La page que vous recherchez n'existe pas (ou plus)
Francois Boye May 22, 2021:
A discussion on whether or not provisions are deductible



https://www.cabinet-d-expertcomptable.com/fiscalite-comptabi...
Dominique Stiver May 22, 2021:
avant de donner l'accord à la solution proposée et qui semble correcte, je préfère soulever la question de savoir "provision sur quoi" car on parle plutôt de "provisions sur charges" (payées d'avance) plutôt que "provision" au sens de "caution", la caution étant la somme servant de dépôt de garantie remboursé après état des lieux, déduction faite des charges ou des dommages laissés par le locataire.
mchd May 22, 2021:
à déduire DE votre provision (de loyer)/de votre caution

Proposed translations

-4
1 hr

To be deducted from your provision

Peer comment(s):
disagree mchd : votre référence n'a trait qu'à la fiscalité. Dans la question posée, il s'agit d'immobilier.
2 hrs
The first part of my attachment refers to accounting.
disagree AllegroTrans : "provision" is not the term used in property leasing/renting
3 hrs
So why are you criticizing me? I never said what you said! Did you read my attachment?
disagree Daryo : this document is an invoice, not the description of an accounting operation. Wrong context.
9 hrs
disagree Adrian MM. : provision means a tenant's advance pd. to the landlord or -lady cf. payment on a/c https://www.proz.com/kudoz/french-to-english/real-estate/577...
20 hrs
Something went wrong...
-1
1 hr

To be deducted from your security deposit

If this invoice is directed to the tenant, then he should have paid an upfront deposit at the time the lease began. I found this entry in WordReference.com:

dépot de garantie: provision en cas de dégradation -- security deposit
Peer comment(s):
agree Adrian MM. : 'Deductible from the advance / payment on a/c': I'm unsure the preposition is in fact wrong cf. boire à même la bouteille - that was about the only grammatical twist our one trick-pony British 'teachers' of French had been astute to.
3 mins
agree philgoddard
48 mins
neutral writeaway : how do we know it's referring to a security deposit???
1 hr
I have worked with a lot of rentals in my previous career, and it is customary to deduct landlord's expenses at the end of the lease from the security deposit, a huissier's move-out inspection for example.
disagree Francois Boye : The first part of my attachment refers to accounting.
2 hrs
I know that it is an accounting concept. This has to do with the landlord and tenant's accounts.
neutral Dominique Stiver : tout à fait d'accord avec François, raison pour laquelle je souhaitais avoir plus de contexte (pourquoi déduire des provisions payées par le locataire d'une caution qu'il a versée au départ ?)
3 hrs
Cela dépend des provisions du contrat de bail.
disagree Daryo : There probably is a "security deposit" somewhere in this story, but THAT would be called "un dépôt de garantie"/"une caution" - not "une provision" + NOTHING to say that this invoice is between the tenant and the owner. Too much extrapolation/assumptions.
9 hrs
disagree Mpoma : Yes, agree with Daryo: given the lack of context we can't assume this is what it is
12 days
Something went wrong...
17 hrs

Your provision to be deducted

je préfère soulever la question de savoir "provision sur quoi" car on parle plutôt de "provisions sur charges" (payées d'avance) plutôt que "provision" au sens de "caution", la caution étant la somme servant de dépôt de garantie remboursé après état des lieux
Peer comment(s):
disagree Francois Boye : It's an amount to be deducted from the provisions in your accounts. why? Because that amount is a provision that has lost its rationale.
5 hrs
agree Daryo
14 days
Something went wrong...
13 days

Payment to be taken from ... [sum of money]

The lack of context means that we can't be sure whether this is a security deposit. All we know is that it is a sum of money paid over by someone: probably a lessee who is now moving out (and this will be for wear and tear, damage, etc. compared to the in-coming inspection report). Even if we could be sure of that situation, many such contracts explicitly say "charges for wear and tear can't be taken from your security deposit".

I don't think we are obliged to use the word "deducted": "taken" strikes me as probably more usual.
Peer comment(s):
neutral Daryo : wouldn't that be: "[your previous advance] payment of (sum of money) to be taken off the total [in the previous line]"?
2 days 16 hrs
Something went wrong...
+1
13 days

Minus your (sum of money)

I agree that there is doubt about what "provision" means here
It clearly is a sum of money and I think it is quite probably a security for wear and tear
Asker says this is the last line before a total, and coming after VAT was added
So it strikes me that it's an amount that has to be minused because it has already been paid, and the total is due (presumably from the tenant to the landlord)

Any takers?
Peer comment(s):
agree Daryo : simply - this "provision" is some kind of advance (of whatever nature) to be deducted from this invoice. // or s.t. like "already paid" or "Your advance (payment)", from the context obviously to be deducted from "the total to pay".
2 days 6 hrs
thanks
neutral Francois Boye : Minus your sum of money means an amount has been deducted from the provisions.
2 days 15 hrs
We don't know exactly how this "provision" is made up and that's precisely the reason why I have put (sum of money)
Something went wrong...
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