Glossary entry (derived from question below)
English term or phrase:
Birhday was / Birthday is
English answer:
"Jane's birthday WAS October 7."
Added to glossary by
CHENOUMI (X)
Jul 4, 2002 00:23
21 yrs ago
English term
Native in: English 
, Spanish
Works in: English to Spanish, Spanish to English, English, and 1 more.
Birhday was / Birthday is
Non-PRO
English
Other
Linguistics
grammar
Im having a friendly discussion with friends and we can't agree on the following: "Jane's birthday was Oct. 7" or "Jane's birthday is Oct. 7" - the question arises as JANE IS DEAD and has been for several years.
Grammarians - please assist and come to my aid -
I wont tell you what I think it is..........
Thanks a million to all!!!
Grammarians - please assist and come to my aid -
I wont tell you what I think it is..........
Thanks a million to all!!!
Responses
| 4 +4 | "Jane's birthday WAS October 7." |
CHENOUMI (X)
|
| 5 +9 | It depends ... |
Chris Rowson (X)
|
| 4 +2 | Jane's birthday is |
Kim Metzger
|
| 4 +1 | I think both expressions are right. |
Chinoise
|
Responses
+4
6 hrs
Selected
"Jane's birthday WAS October 7."
Jane appears to be deceased. If that's so, then Use the Past tense.
>>>In every language that I know, everything associated with a dead person, is referred to in the past tense.
"So and so LIKED beer"
"So and so USED to do this and that"
"So and so WAS like this or that..."
So, why would there be an exception for their birthdays? :)
HTH.
>>>In every language that I know, everything associated with a dead person, is referred to in the past tense.
"So and so LIKED beer"
"So and so USED to do this and that"
"So and so WAS like this or that..."
So, why would there be an exception for their birthdays? :)
HTH.
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thanks to all of you for your ideas and comments, however I am choosing was, because Jane's birthday will never again be celebrated by anyone, unlike Bach's, Jane Austin's, Martin Luther King Jr.'s, etc.
Again many thanks to all of you for your input!"
+1
4 mins
Chinoise
Specializes in field
I think both expressions are right.
The latter is more often used when you are talking a person whom you or others are familiar with.
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Note added at 2002-07-04 00:40:39 (GMT)
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For instance, if you are talking about Jane Austin, surely you would say \"Jane\'s birthday is...\", despite the fact that she passed away long ago. Moreover, when referring to the people we(you) do not know well, we can also use the present tense. Why not do that since each human being\'s birthday is as fixed as an accredited public holiday?
We may also call this usage as a typical example of \"dramatic language\"---i.e. sometimes writers use the present tense all the time throughout the whole novel to enliven their language, although everything they describe took place in the long past!
I am not denying the usage of the past tense here. What I mean is that whomever she is, we know that we can use both tenses for sure.
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Note added at 2002-07-04 00:43:31 (GMT)
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(Grammatically speaking, there is a typo there on the first line: talking about.)
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Note added at 2002-07-04 00:43:49 (GMT)
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(Grammatically speaking, there is a typo there on the first line: talking about.)
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-07-04 00:40:39 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
For instance, if you are talking about Jane Austin, surely you would say \"Jane\'s birthday is...\", despite the fact that she passed away long ago. Moreover, when referring to the people we(you) do not know well, we can also use the present tense. Why not do that since each human being\'s birthday is as fixed as an accredited public holiday?
We may also call this usage as a typical example of \"dramatic language\"---i.e. sometimes writers use the present tense all the time throughout the whole novel to enliven their language, although everything they describe took place in the long past!
I am not denying the usage of the past tense here. What I mean is that whomever she is, we know that we can use both tenses for sure.
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Note added at 2002-07-04 00:43:31 (GMT)
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(Grammatically speaking, there is a typo there on the first line: talking about.)
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Note added at 2002-07-04 00:43:49 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
(Grammatically speaking, there is a typo there on the first line: talking about.)
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
rvillaronga
: I do too.....
35 mins
|
|
Thanks a lot!
|
|
| neutral |
John Kinory (X)
: I'd say Jane Austen birthday was, unless I feel such affinity with her that I consider her to be still with us.
11 hrs
|
+2
11 mins
Kim Metzger
Mexico
Mexico
Native in English
&
English
Works in field
Mexico
Committed to Quality and Service
Native in: English (Variant: US) 
Works in: German to English
Related KudoZ points
:
187
Jane's birthday is
October the 7th was originally and will always be Jane's birthday. You can say Jane was born on Oct. 7, but a birthday is the annual anniversary of the day on which someone was born.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Lia Fail (X)
: Nothing, even death, does not change the fact of someone's 'birth day'
26 mins
|
| agree |
CHENOUMI (X)
1 hr
|
| agree |
Сергей Лузан
6 hrs
|
| disagree |
mickymayes
: Jane's date of birth does not change
4 days
|
+9
14 mins
It depends ...
Using Fred for examples, since we don´t know whether he is dead or not, "Fred´s birthday is ... " refers to his next birthday, or to all his birthdays.
"Fred´s birthday was ..." refers to his last birthday, or any previous one (but only one).
"Fred´s birthday was ... " referring to all his birthdays works for dead people too: "J.S. Bach´s birthday is (I should know but don´t :-)". You still have a birthday even if you are dead. But your last (and all previous ones) are in the past.
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Note added at 2002-07-04 00:42:05 (GMT)
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So for the context you give, it is \"Jane´s birthday is\", because it is refers to all of them, the cyclical event (otherwise you wouldn´t be having the discussion, because for a previous or a future one it is obvious how to say it).
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Note added at 2002-07-04 02:32:36 (GMT)
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I see I have a horrible mistake above: the third paragraph should be \"\'Fred´s birthday IS ...\' referring to all his birthdays works for dead people too\".
Bach´s birthday is March 21. (I looked it up.) You don´t say Bach´s birthday was March 21, unless you mean a specific one.
"Fred´s birthday was ..." refers to his last birthday, or any previous one (but only one).
"Fred´s birthday was ... " referring to all his birthdays works for dead people too: "J.S. Bach´s birthday is (I should know but don´t :-)". You still have a birthday even if you are dead. But your last (and all previous ones) are in the past.
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Note added at 2002-07-04 00:42:05 (GMT)
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So for the context you give, it is \"Jane´s birthday is\", because it is refers to all of them, the cyclical event (otherwise you wouldn´t be having the discussion, because for a previous or a future one it is obvious how to say it).
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Note added at 2002-07-04 02:32:36 (GMT)
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I see I have a horrible mistake above: the third paragraph should be \"\'Fred´s birthday IS ...\' referring to all his birthdays works for dead people too\".
Bach´s birthday is March 21. (I looked it up.) You don´t say Bach´s birthday was March 21, unless you mean a specific one.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Ingrid Petit
13 mins
|
| agree |
Parrot
: best explanation
47 mins
|
| agree |
Paul Mably (X)
: well explained
1 hr
|
| agree |
CHENOUMI (X)
1 hr
|
| agree |
Midori Wilson
4 hrs
|
| agree |
cheungmo
: partifcularly the final paraphraph
4 hrs
|
| agree |
Piotr Kurek
5 hrs
|
| agree |
jerrie
7 hrs
|
| neutral |
John Kinory (X)
: Not sure I agree. JSB is still considered to be 'with us', therefore his birthday is. I definitely say 'My late mother's birthday WAS xx.yy'.
11 hrs
|
| agree |
mickymayes
4 days
|
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