Glossary entry (derived from question below)
Spanish term or phrase:
Las piedras tienen en sí y para sí formas abstractas
English translation:
stones, by their very nature, are comprised of abstract forms
Added to glossary by
Jenni Lukac (X)
Aug 11, 2011 13:06
12 yrs ago
Spanish term
Spain
Analytical and creative (DipTrans, MA)
Native in: English 
Works in: Spanish to English, Galician to English, English
Las piedras tienen en sí y para sí formas abstractas
Spanish to English
Art/Literary
Art, Arts & Crafts, Painting
Exhibition catalogue, art criticism, collecting
Context:
Cuando era pequeña coleccionaba estos restos. Así fue cómo conseguí formar una maravillosa colección de piedras. Más tarde, en mis viajes a través de Sudamérica, iba con mi marido a las minas y me traía piedras. Mi camino hacia el arte abstracto pasa a través de las piedras. La naturaleza es abstracta. Las piedras tienen en sí y para sí formas abstractas. En una colección de piedras se aprende a reconocer formas. La aguamarina, por ejemplo, es diferente del cuarzo rosa.
From a quote by an art collector explaining why she collects.
I understand the basic meaning, but the "en sí y para sí" has got me thinking. I at least want to maintain the emphasis that the phrase gives to this idea of stones being intrinsically abstract (I think that's what she wants to say).
How would you put this "en sí y para sí"?
UK Eng
Thanks for your help in advance.
Cuando era pequeña coleccionaba estos restos. Así fue cómo conseguí formar una maravillosa colección de piedras. Más tarde, en mis viajes a través de Sudamérica, iba con mi marido a las minas y me traía piedras. Mi camino hacia el arte abstracto pasa a través de las piedras. La naturaleza es abstracta. Las piedras tienen en sí y para sí formas abstractas. En una colección de piedras se aprende a reconocer formas. La aguamarina, por ejemplo, es diferente del cuarzo rosa.
From a quote by an art collector explaining why she collects.
I understand the basic meaning, but the "en sí y para sí" has got me thinking. I at least want to maintain the emphasis that the phrase gives to this idea of stones being intrinsically abstract (I think that's what she wants to say).
How would you put this "en sí y para sí"?
UK Eng
Thanks for your help in advance.
Proposed translations
(English)
References
| Jean-Paul Sartre |
Stephen D
|
Change log
Aug 25, 2011 06:58: Jenni Lukac (X) Created KOG entry
Proposed translations
+6
7 mins
Selected
stones, by their very nature, are comprised of abstract forms
An option.
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
+3
12 mins
Robert Forstag
United States
United States
Native in English
Works in field
United States
Translating words, preserving meaning
Native in: English
Works in: Spanish to English, English
Related KudoZ points
:
134
Stones are intrinsically and irreducibly abstract.
"Para sí" would literally man "for themselves," but such a notion and translation make no sense here. Instead, the whole phrase "en sí y para sí" strikes me as simply emphasizing the abstract nature of the stones.
Suerte.
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Note added at 24 mins (2011-08-11 13:31:14 GMT)
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Typo in explanation:
"Para sí" would literally mEan...
Suerte.
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Note added at 24 mins (2011-08-11 13:31:14 GMT)
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Typo in explanation:
"Para sí" would literally mEan...
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
philgoddard
: This is good.
2 hrs
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Thank you, Phil!
|
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| agree |
Evans (X)
: or just "intrinsically" by itself.
2 hrs
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Thank you, Gilla. Although I would say that "intrinsically and irreducibly" seems best to reflect the emphasis of "en si y para si."
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| agree |
Eileen Banks
: :)
3 hrs
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Thank you, Eileen.
|
+3
31 mins
The stones are abstract forms in and of themselves.
This is probably how I'd say it myself if I was looking to express this idea.
Example sentence:
"I approach all of my sculpture as pure forms in and of themselves in the hope that they may elicit a tactile response."
"it showcases mediums of communication, ie: screens, computers, paper, books, mp3s, human bodies, etc, as art forms in and of themselves."
Reference:
http://www.oconnellsculpture.com/about.html
http://amypagnotta.blogspot.com/2011/03/great-hall-2nd-floor-ocad-free-and.html
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
franglish
: no need to look further :)
3 hrs
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thank you, franglish!
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| agree |
JH Trads
: I was going to answer using 'in and of themselves', could not agree more
6 hrs
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thank you, Hugo!
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| agree |
Altogringo
: Dead on the phrase.
1 day 14 hrs
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cheers, Alto!
|
18 hrs
Adriana Diaz Enciso
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Native in Spanish
Specializes in field
United Kingdom
Genuine love for language for + 30 years
Native in: Spanish
Works in: English to Spanish, Spanish to English, French to Spanish
Stones have abstract forms, in and of themselves
I agree with eliminating the article. "The stones" would seem to mean some particular stones. I would prefer "have abstract forms" instead of "are abstract forms" for, though the translation does not have to be literal, the original text is clearly saying "tienen" when in Spanish it would also make sense "son", and there is a difference between being a form and having a form.
Reference comments
8 mins
Reference:
Jean-Paul Sartre
Jean-Paul Sartre talked about two types of being: "being-for-itself" and "being-in-itself". I hope this may help someone formulate a suitable answer.
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